Britt Daniel
Britt Daniel is not only a treasure to Austin’s music community, but worldwide as an indie-rock hero. He is best known as the lead singer and primary songwriter for Spoon, his band that has been going strong since being founded in 1993. I happened to encounter him after a book talk for A Curious Mix of People (a book about Austin’s underground music scene in the 90s). He very kindly allowed me to have a chat with him and ask him some questions.
Considering Spoon is an indie band, have you seen early fans or even friends shun you or disrespect you and your band for becoming successful?
Britt Daniel:
No one shuns or disrespects me for being successful now that I’m aware of, but when we started out there was a bit of that notion that being ambitious was uncool; specifically being ambitious enough to put out a record on a label that was not self-released. Or just based in Austin or having been ambitious enough to want to be seen outside of Austin. The Austin scene in the 90s prided itself on being underground, and that worked out well for it in a lot of ways. But, there was some blowback when they could tell that you wanted a level of success that might be outside of that scene.
What was your reaction to that mentality?
Britt Daniel:
Well, I mean, it didn’t stop me from doing what I wanted to do, but I was aware of it. There were parts of that attitude -that sort of way of looking at art and commerce- that I can respect. When we finished our first album and labels were calling on us we ended up signing with the smallest one. It was still a pretty well funded one, and it would happen to be where all my favorite bands at the time were signed. But if we really wanted to reach a ton of people quickly we would have gone with one of the other five labels that came calling, all of the major labels that came calling.
What does success mean to you?
Britt Daniel:
With art it’s like making art that you’re happy with and that’s success. With the band, I guess that translates to making a song or a recording that I’m proud of. There’s all these different levels. I think the goal is to try to appreciate each one. Like the fact that you can get up and be on stage at all, that’s success. The fact that you get to tour at all, that’s success. The fact that you get to tour and not lose money in the process that’s another level. And, I don’t know, hearing one of your songs on the radio or something. Or, getting to a place where you can support yourself doing music. Those are all different levels, and I feel like, I think, you know I’ve talked with Jim about this many times, the fact that it did take us so long to find success, to get to a place where we were putting out records where people seemed like they wanted to hear and that we weren’t losing money on the road, because it took so long for that it seems like we sort of appreciated each step along the way. I’ve seen a lot of bands that kind of just jump right to the top and then there’s kind of nowhere to go. I don’t know if you appreciate all of the stops along the way that you’ve just kind of jumped over.
Yeah, I mean, if there’s too much success at the beginning sometimes it taints a band’s career along the way. I’ve never seen that with Spoon.
Britt Daniel:
Yeah, well thanks. I mean we certainly haven’t had the problem with immediate success, you’re right.
Have you ever seen narratives about your band that go around, you know, are false, and you would like to expose as untrue?
Britt Daniel:
Little petty things that don’t really matter, but I hear all the time that Jim is the producer and I think it might almost bug Jim as much as it does me. Because he has a studio, sometimes people are like Jim is the mastermind, he’s produced all the records. We all produce the records, but we’ve always brought in a [outside] producer. So that’s one thing we see a lot.
You don’t have to name names or anything, but are there some general/common issues with band dynamics you’ve noticed? With your band, in your experience.
Britt Daniel:
I think we’ve gotten past a lot of [issues] kind of typical for a lot of dudes starting a band. At first I wasn’t very welcome to outside opinions or ideas. If somebody had an idea, like a way to start the song or how we can get a gig, that was fine. But certain things I was very precious about, like about the actual songwriting, or maybe the ideas in the studio, and it just seems like the longer we’ve gone there’s been less and less ego involved. I feel like anybody can kind of say ‘yeah I don’t really hear where that’s going’ or ‘let’s try that but I’m not sure I get it’. And then you try it and then you have a chance to say that’s working or that’s not working, you know. It just feels like it’s a little bit more adult and less precious.
More cohesive, more collaborative.
Britt Daniel:
Yeah, more collaborative, more respectful. I think that everybody was growing up at the same time and now we work with people who have great ideas, so that helps too.
Awesome. Let’s go back to the ideas of success and touring. You were saying that touring and being able to go out and perform for fans is a great part of that idea of success. But, it often seems like more and more I see artists going on really long tours and sometimes if I catch them at the end of the tour they just seem exhausted. From your experience what is the cost benefit of tours overall? Like, physically, emotionally, financially, or we can just stick to one of those. Like, say, physically.
Britt Daniel:
Well, I do like touring a lot. I like doing shows. I’m lucky, because there are a lot of musicians that just don’t feel the same, but it actually feels like a good thing mentally for me to be out traveling and doing shows. I feel like my focus becomes much more limited and my enjoyment becomes much more great. All I can focus on is, where am I gonna get lunch today? Is there a shower here, can I get a shower? And you’re hanging out with your buddies, you’ve got a thing to look forward to at the end of the night and you’re in a different environment everyday and it just sort of works for me. It doesn’t work for everybody. So, for me, I can deal with a lot but I know a lot of people that aren’t that lucky.
Does performing put a strain on your mental health?
Britt Daniel:
Yeah, it can be [that way]. I’d say overall it’s a healthy thing for my mental health. I find sometimes it depends on the situation, you can get thrown in a situation where you don’t feel comfortable. You can get thrown into a situation where you get anxious before the show. Overall, though, you know it’s like these little challenges make you stronger, they make you greater, they make you feel like you’ve accomplished something.
Have you ever opened for someone exceptionally big or done a headlining show or festival appearance that you remember being very nerve-wracking?
Britt Daniel:
It’s generally a little more nerve-wracking if you play in town, in your hometown. There’s lots of family, there’s lots of people there you know. You play in front of your record label folks sometimes and you’re a little more in your head than you’d like to be. There’s some things about touring, you know, you probably want to know what the hard things about it are. There have been times where I’ve felt like, am I getting anywhere? Especially in certain countries where you may say the level of success isn’t as great. It can be frustrating to go back there and just feel like; ‘What are we doing here? We’re possibly gonna lose money.” Those things can be trying.
Just generally when you talk about touring, it’s just like, for me it’s 90% of the time a blast. But, believe me I recognize it can be difficult for people who struggle with it. It takes a physical toll for sure. I get a lot less sleep. I tend to stay up late and you know get into some behavior that I may not get into when I’m at home. That can take a physical toll. Generally, it’s alright. I’ve been pretty lucky.
I’m glad to hear that. It’s definitely a blast for the fans as well.
Britt Daniel:
Yeah, lucky for me, lucky for you, lucky for everybody.
Do you ever feel separate from how you feel on stage? Like is there ever like an on-stage mindset or self versus being offstage?
Britt Daniel:
Yeah, maybe. I mean there's a certain level of disconnection that might be beneficial. Er, I say that but I’m trying to think. I can remember a time last year when I went on stage quite emotional. But I remember walking on stage thinking, I’m not sure if I’m gonna be able to get through this. Like, I’m not sure why I’m here or if this is gonna work out so great. I’m not sure if I’m gonna be able to get my head in the game basically. It ended up being one of the best shows, you know, I’d done in years because I used that emotion. But there’s something to be said for getting your game face on. Just knowing there’s a show to do you’re gonna get into this frame of mind that you need to be in.
Yeah, that’s really interesting to think about, channeling your emotions. Do you ever feel like you transcend kind of, performance wise? Kind of feel in another world?
Britt Daniel:
There have been a lot of shows where you go up on stage and you think it’s just not gonna work and it does work, it works great. Maybe it takes a few songs. There’s something about doing the show and the interaction. The fact that you’re playing music and music is a wonderful thing and you can focus on that, you can feel it. All of that can bring you out of a negative headspace. There’s times, especially around the time of Transference maybe, like times where we would go up and we would be doing shows and I would feel a little not there. I didn’t understand. I did feel disconnected in a bad way. Where I was very in my head thinking we were fucking it up somehow, we weren’t doing a good show. And that would feed on itself. I don’t really get like that anymore, and I think it was particularly that album cycle in general that was just kind of a rough one. With what was going on with everybody in the band and what was going on onstage. So that can be uncomfortable but generally it’s a positive experience for me.
So would you say most of the time now it brings you out of your head?
Britt Daniel:
Yeah, the best shows happen when I feel loose and where I just feel like I’m not in my head and I’m totally in the moment and things just happen, both musically and in terms of the interaction with the audience. So the interaction with the band, the interaction with the song and the interaction with the audience, if you can just sort of let those things happen without thinking then that’s a great place to be.
What do you feel about being compared to other artists? Is that a positive thing? What do you think about that?
Britt Daniel:
I don’t know, do we get compared to other artists? I mean I guess we used to. I don’t know, I just feel like criticism, music criticism is just gonna happen you can’t really control it. It is what it is. I’m gonna expect that most music criticism is gonna be written on a deadline. It doesn’t bother me. And I try not to read reviews at this point.
Do you think you could expand real quick on how bad reviews affect you as an artist?
Britt Daniel:
Yeah I mean I think that they affect anybody because I think, at some point I realized there was really no point in reading reviews because, good or bad, it wasn’t information that I needed. If it was a bad review; I could read ten reviews and there would be one that was bad and the only thing that I would remember was the specific criticism from the one bad review. That was just some one person’s subjective experience. I can’t/ I really shouldn’t be worrying about that. I should be worrying about how it felt to me to make it. The experience of making it and the experience of finishing it and what I thought of it. If it pleases me that’s really ground zero. That’s where you gotta start. Even if I would read good reviews, I would find that I just don’t need it. I don’t want to be trying to replicate what was good. It all sort of detracts from the headspace you need to be in to make art that’s loose and pure and unguided by anyone else.
Yeah, as an artist, what’s most important is feeling good about your art when you’re creating it.
Britt Daniel:
Yeah, that process is very important.
Would you rather someone sit down with your record and listen to it all the way through? Is that more valuable to you than getting a hit song?
Britt Daniel:
Ideally both.
Any of that love is appreciated, I’m assuming.
Britt Daniel:
Yeah. I mean I’ve never really had a hit song, I guess it depends on how you define a hit. Really the first thing that I think about, if I’m thinking about anything when I’m making it other than how it actually feels good to me, is about somebody sitting down and listening to an album because I’ve just done that so many times. The reason I got into this is because I loved music and specifically albums. I just thought that was the ideal statement of a musical artist’s material, that was it to me. If you can do forty minutes that’s a cohesive piece of art that was just the greatest. So yeah, maybe that, someone sitting down and listening to it.